Curse

FengShuiBundi · Aug 26, 2005, 02:11 PM // 14:11

I am happy.

Thank you for making Signet of Humility Inspiration-tied as opposed to Illusion-tied.

super dooper · Aug 26, 2005, 03:42 PM // 15:42

I agree with most of the changes, and a few of them don't bother me enough for me to lose sleep over, as there are so many skills and a slight change in one isn't going to ruin my life. :P nice update.

and crazy faction FTW. :P

Mysterial · Aug 26, 2005, 04:18 PM // 16:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yawgmoth Kg

no ones thinks that enchatment removal needs a buff?

I don't think so, but I'm willing to be convinced otherwise. So far, the primary argument I've heard is "here come the healing balls", which got nerfed seperately via Healing Seed's duration being reduced.

Sinbios · Aug 26, 2005, 04:41 PM // 16:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sekkira

With this revelation, I'm here left to wonder if Fissure armour is now attainable at all. We all know WHY the solo build was even thought of in the first place. It's time to do something about the REAL problem.

Heh.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sinbios

Indeed, no other class can solo with such efficiency. And now, nobody will solo with such efficiency; the overall ecto farming efficiency will drop. He~llo, 30k ectos!

It's only the second day.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Numa Pompilius

If all you're playing for is the FoW armor, then that sounds like a good idea, yeah.

But that's the whole point of FoW armour, d'you see - to give people who has finished the game several times to have something to look forward to. Not everyone wants to pvp all day.

Flowah · Aug 26, 2005, 04:48 PM // 16:48

Yeah I think it's hilarious that all you idiots are talking about solo monks ruining the economy. Well the price of ecto jumped 4k overnight. Hahahahahahaha. Idiots. More ecto = more supply = less expensive. I horded some ecto in anticipation for this, and will happily be awaiting the day it reaches 30-50k a piece. Wheeeeeeee.

cat1982 · Aug 26, 2005, 04:53 PM // 16:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flowah

Yeah I think it's hilarious that all you idiots are talking about solo monks ruining the economy. Well the price of ecto jumped 4k overnight. Hahahahahahaha. Idiots. More ecto = more supply = less expensive. I horded some ecto in anticipation for this, and will happily be awaiting the day it reaches 30-50k a piece. Wheeeeeeee.

and then what?

you'll sell it, you'll have money...and then what?

Its ultimately meaningless, and you'll find that out when you actually have more money then you can spend

C
Xxx

Phades · Aug 26, 2005, 05:15 PM // 17:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sinbios

But that's the whole point of FoW armour, d'you see - to give people who has finished the game several times to have something to look forward to. Not everyone wants to pvp all day.

So, you quit the day you get FoW armor? That is not much to look forward to. Pvp is the end game for GW like it or not. There really is no end game in pve that begins to compare with other pve formats. Even most of the bonus material from the exclusive end game areas like FoW are exp bonuses, which only help aquire more skill points to get the character rounded out faster in order to pvp in any possible situation.

Hippie Crack · Aug 26, 2005, 05:20 PM // 17:20

To everyone saying spirits are dead, no, they arent. Just the PUG's spamming them is now gone. My team just won the hall 2x's in a row starting from UW, and you know what we're using? Spirits. If you know how to use spirits the nerf shouldn't effect you in the least. My team never did run an oath shot spammer. Dropping fertile with 1min left in the match still gets the job done, go go sudden 300hp spike. NR still serves its purpose, and thats to counter altar builds, AKA Life Bond + Seed teams.

They honestly didn't nerf anything except the cookie-cutter builds/teams, maybe now people will start being a little more creative. Props to the korean's that knocked us out, very interesting build using Amity + energy denial + DoT's.

stumpy · Aug 26, 2005, 05:21 PM // 17:21

wow in the matter of 10 hours we have 10 pages already. I will sell my ecto ... not because I need the money ... god knows thre is no real value to money in the first place, and I have too much anyway. But I will sell it to get the inventory space. I dont rightly care for FoW armor. I much prefer my patchwork rainbow armor

Neo-LD · Aug 26, 2005, 05:27 PM // 17:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hippie Crack

To everyone saying spirits are dead, no, they arent. Just the PUG's spamming them is now gone. My team just won the hall 2x's in a row starting from UW, and you know what we're using? Spirits. If you know how to use spirits the nerf shouldn't effect you in the least. My team never did run an oath shot spammer. Dropping fertile with 1min left in the match still gets the job done, go go sudden 300hp spike. NR still serves its purpose, and thats to counter altar builds, AKA Life Bond + Seed teams.

They honestly didn't nerf anything except the cookie-cutter builds/teams, maybe now people will start being a little more creative. Props to the korean's that knocked us out, very interesting build using Amity + energy denial + DoT's.

But now the spirits are killable and you cant have hundreds of them. When that fertile drops, its gonna die pretty quick.

Arcador · Aug 26, 2005, 05:37 PM // 17:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by -z|o-

I hoped for more changes ... =/

Like changing the game from corpg to car racing?

Quote:

WHAT!!, i just finish busting out 100k+ for my invinci monk now it gets nerfed ?!?!?! i hope every one deserts gw and anet gets screwed seriously wtf.... how am i suppost to come up with 1000k+ for fissure..

OMG NOW I HAVE TO COLLECT MONEY AS EVERYONE ELSE!!!!111.. I HATE THIS GAME I HATE ARENANET I HATE LIFE I HATE EVERYTHING!

it is not even funny. It is sad.

Quote:

I'm leaving because of /nerf period! I don't have a invinci monk or play ss or any ranger in pvp for that matter. I just don't like the fact that they feel the need to nerf everything. Thats the way I feel, and Im off to play other games. BF2 and WOW. Oh and ANETs idea was to make money off of expansions for guildwars. Good luck because my gw is going in the trash.

The devils got you this time. Cya. Have fun with WoW.

Quote:

..I am gonna stop playing I think. I spent sooo many hours saving the gold to buy those damn runes, just to farm. I am just about breaking even, but all my time lost. People who whine... they could do what I did, make a monk and save! They to could have one! But no Anet has not sense. I am going to WoW! I left there to try GW. The only thing that kept me here was its price. Now that they screwed up the game, I am better off going back to a solid game. I was growing tired of it anyway. Without farming, Ill never get that cool armor. No one ever accused computer programers of being economically efficient...

You should not try GW at the first place. It is silly to take one game just for the price and keeping in your mind you took it only for that reason. Have fun collecting arcanite bars in WoW (with 48 HOURS cooldown each) and you will remember the good old days when they nerfed the prot bond.

Quote:

I really expected better balance changes than this.................... so many weak skills ignored and so many other skills um.......... nerfed? (I do not care about prot bond) I am done with guild wars for now... see you all at the next update......

Well I was hoping they will introduce m16s and hand grenades but...well...we are still stick with bows and swords.

Quote:

I won't heal any of you anyway, so eh =). Also, just because they nerfed protective bond, doesn't mean there aren't other ways to solo UW. Not all builds are public, this includes mine.

See? People think and find ways. Think alternative and you will find quite a lot ways to solo.

Quote:

Distracting shot is even faster now. But they made crippling shot near useless (IMO). 8 second cripple is pretty lame for a 15e skill. Wow, they lowered the recharge to 1 second...lol, it can be spammed twice (for most rangers)! Huzzah!

Since it was always 15 seconds (even with 1 marksmanship) they decided to make it some sort of nerfed I guess. If you have 9+ makrs you should stick to Pin down.

With 1 sec cooldown and 25 mana you can cripple 2 persons for 8 seconds, which might be some sort of boost. We will see it and then speak again.

Quote:

WOW ! thanks Anet, now i cant farm anyomore with my monk, cant do griffon run, cant do nothing. the results are : i cant get money and items anymore, theres nothink left to do except PvP i think i will stop playing this game and i farmed for a few days because i just ascended with monk ! now i will be poor and i cant buy any good item for my characters ! FU ANET !

Sarcasm for llife

and so on....
------------

Ok. PvE is NOT FARMING, so nefring Prot bond and so on does not nerf PvE. If you understand PvE with Farming go play WoW, Lineage or similar game when you can FARM ALL YOU WANT, no limits - just you and your farming.

Changing one skill a bit should motive you finding another use of it - adapt of the change, view the skill use from different points...or at least try. Complaining 6 hours after the update is just lame and some people EVEN quited the game (OMG...I hope they overreact). What you people do when get some fight (argue fight) with a friend? You quit being friend with this guys forever? This is PVP event - so they will monitor the skills at that time and I AM SURE they will make another changes in the near time (when the event ends and days after.) Complainers never really win. They can get a momental benefit but in long term none. Keep that in mind. I am not happy with some skills too but I don't "HATE ARENA NET!!1!"

Thor Wolfson · Aug 26, 2005, 06:27 PM // 18:27

I like the update overall. I'm almost done with my 3rd character and I'm about to turn PvP. I like the death of spirit spammers; whenever my guild tried a HoH run, it was death by spirits. Gj A-net!

I was making an invincimonk, but i figured it was going to get nerfed. It's pretty fun being a healer anyways.

Now it's time to farm with my W/Mo, with the healing hands buffed. Woohoo!

Time to go get myself some faction.

Sandman Uk · Aug 26, 2005, 06:28 PM // 18:28

I am sure there will be a second Skills update after the PVPX weekend either Monday Or Tuesday. They will be monitoring all weekend in the PVPX event for a final tweak before the Summer update.

We dont want solo farmers farming all the new content in sorrows now do we.

Darkest Dawn · Aug 26, 2005, 07:27 PM // 19:27

I like that they made our pets a bit more useful. No real comment on the rest, except my necro character got a bit of a lift....

Xonic · Aug 26, 2005, 07:34 PM // 19:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calibretto_9

Yeah, I agree that we don't need it. On the other hand, they shouldn't make things in the game that are going to be unattainable for all practical reasons. Unattainable goals are just frustrating, not constructive.

how is it "unattainable" without solo farming?

sounds like you want everything and anything readily available to you without needing to work for them.

Ferrari is "unattainable" too, you feeling frustrated about it?

IxChel · Aug 26, 2005, 07:41 PM // 19:41

Finally; a much needed buff to the strength line. The Dwarven Battle Stance is effectively 6 "spike" interrupts every 30 seconds -- that's nice for shutting down a healer when you're on them. I previously ruled out I Will Avenge You since warriors are usually far away from the soft-casters, so if they die, you didn't get a bonus; I can imagine this is quite helpful when your monk dies...

Elythor · Aug 26, 2005, 07:53 PM // 19:53

I still dont see how Dwarven Battle Stance is a viable elite compared to others like Devastating Hammer or Backbreaker.

However, if you have 3 warriors ganking the monk the it might be useful....you just have to rely on others to deal dmg for you.

Jake · Aug 26, 2005, 08:23 PM // 20:23

Yeah battle stance basically got a 1 second boost from 10 seconds max to 11 seconds max, really awesome!!!! Can't really complain too much though or we'll get stampeded by the "WARRIORS ARE AMAZING U IDIOT" people. Some players would like more variety in their builds rather than being forced to use the same shit to be the most effective.

Mercury Angel · Aug 26, 2005, 08:41 PM // 20:41

Elementalist-

* Meteor: Lowered Energy cost to 5
: I still don't like it. It was never the cost that was a problem for me, the exhaustion was mildly annoying, and the 3 second cast, 30 second recharge were the real problems, neither of which was changed.

* Fireball: Lowered Energy cost to 10 and recharge time to 7 seconds
:Nice. Won't complain here, this was a change to make a good skill better.

* Chain Lightning: Increased cast time to 3 seconds; decreased damage to 10..85; changed recharge to 10 seconds; lowered maximum distance between targets
:Balanced with other air skills, I didn't think it was too bad. In the context of overall balance, I understand the reasoning. At least the recharge was buffed.

* Glyph of Sacrifice: Reduced recharge penalty on next spell to 90 seconds
:Not going to make a huge difference in timers, but ok. The buff was still nice.

* Mark of Rodgort: Reduced cast time to 1 second; increased duration of burning effect to 1..4 seconds
:Casting time I understand... Burning time, umm? If you're hitting someone with a weapon, you'll hit frequently enough to keep them burning constantly under 3 seconds.
My guess is that this was to make it easier to reach 3 seconds, so you don't need as much fire.
In that context, I get it then.

Elementalist changes were dissapointing, to say the least. Fire is already a great PvE line, and it's still not a great PvP line. Air hasn't changed much.

Water and Earth are still support lines people are mainly grabbing for the wards and defence bonuses over anything else.
Don't get me wrong, wards are great for their AoE aspect, and the fact that once they're up, they can't be removed...
But that's a rather shaky reason to take the class with description that mentions 'calling down elemental forces to obliterate the enemy'.

However, in the end, I suppose that it'll take a major overhaul of the elementalist concept in order to really 'fix' the class, and that's probably not something to do as a quick fix for an 'extreme pvp' weekend test.

---
Mesmer-

# Cry of Frustration: Lowered casting time to .25 second
: Ok, it's an interrupt. This was a reasonable change.

# Mantra of Earth: Lowered Energy cost to 10
# Mantra of Flame: Lowered Energy cost to 10
# Mantra of Lightning: Lowered Energy cost to 10
# Mantra of Frost: Lowered Energy cost to 10
:They're still not going to see much use, in my opinion. Using one of these is like adding a 40 AL buff to ONE element. With only 8 skill slots, these skills tend to be far too conditional for PvP, and in a combo, they're still only decent.

# Mantra of Recall: Lowered Energy cost to 10; lowered the amount of Energy you gain back to 3..28
:I actually liked it better when it stored more energy. In any case, what made it more popular previously was the ability to end it early and control the energy gain by merely activating another stance. I doubt this skill will see much use either again. Maybe a Contemplation of Purity monk will discover it and fall in love one day, though. Who knows?

# Signet of Humility: Changed the related attribute to Inspiration Magic; changed duration of effect to scale from 1..16 seconds based on rank in Inspiration Magic
:This skill was very good with no attribute. Now it's not. Considering how easily it handed any elite-based strategy, this was probably for the best, although I will miss simply grabbing it when I have a skill slot left.
The attribute choice, despite shutdown generally being a Domination type thing, is both fitting for the name, and reasonably linked to many other signet enhancing skills.
Maybe there will be enough decent signets one day to really warrant using them.

# Shatter Hex: Reduced AOE to "nearby foes"; reduced damage to 30..120
: It costs 15. >.< I could see the AoE Reduction easily, but why the damage? It's not really all that much better than Smite Hex now, but it sure costs a lot more. Maybe drop it to 10 cost?

# Hex Breaker: Reduced duration to 15..90 seconds
:I don't even get the point of this. The duration has never mattered. I always threw in leftover points for the extra damage, and that's not going to change.

# Panic: Increased duration to 10..25 seconds; Increased AOE to "nearby foes"
My experience with this hasn't been amazing, and I've tried, but couldn't hex more than 2 people at once in random PvP. Perhaps the applications are more useful in tombs specific maps.
If you can tag 2 people with it, it's worth the cost in energy loss [~17 energy loss per person], at least, and the signet backfire effect isn't amazing, but it's at least something.

Having actually tried an e/me mesmer with Ether Renewal to refill my energy, and Diversion+Wastrel's spam (Wastrel's is a spammable skill to trigger Ether Renewal, and you can use it between Diversion's for a little damage, and no penalty). I'd have to say, I liked it as much as I liked my mesmer primary RP char. Resillience AND shutdown ability. As for Fast Casting, I say meh.
I'd like to see some changes to make actually being a mesmer primary more rewarding in the future, but once again, this is probably something to save for another time.
---
Monk-

* Healing Seed: Lowered Energy cost to 10; Decreased duration to 10 seconds
:Pretty much everyone said 'Healing Seed is GODLY in PvE", and it was good in PvP as well, especially in combination with certain skills. When people are praising a skill as godly, the nerf should be pretty obvious.'
Healing Seed just got better, and better, with more healing prayers. Maxxed out, it lasted 21 seconds, and could keep a whole group healed, pretty much, with just one casting.

* Scourge Sacrifice: Now affects all adjacent targets
:Still conditional, still mostly garbage. BiP'ers don't have to stand next to people to enchant them, and if they're giving them an energy boost, I doubt they're a BiP'er.

* Restore Condition: Lowered Energy to 5; reduced the amount healed to 10..70
:Great decision on the energy cost reduction, the healing's still great. The only thing I don't like about it is that you can't cast it on yourself, and you still need Mend Ailment for that: That being the case, why even bring this? >.<
I'd settle for a severe drop in healing if you could cast it on yourself. Until then, who's not going to just stick with Martyr and Mend?

* Healing Hands: Increased the amount healed to 5..30
: Hopefully helps out Healing Hands users. I still don't like the skill much, but wa/mo's often swear by it. Maybe it's because I never have enough AL to make much use of it.

* Draw Conditions: Added 1 second recharge time
: =added .25 second downtime to it... yeah, big difference.

* Divine Boon: Added 1 second recharge time
: =see above. I think Divine Boon+Ether Renewal spam is pointless, anyway. You can't cast and walk, so it's generally better to smite off of someone else.

* Protective Bond: Energy lost per hit increased to 6..3
:Never really played with this skill, so I wouldn't know what a difference it makes. Ever since I'd seen a mo/w use it a long time ago at 2 energy loss, I'd realized that with its pattern of energy loss, it'd hit 1 at 17.

* Aegis: Now only affects party members
: Won't make a great difference, seeing as you rarely have anything but party members. Those few times where you have an ally to protect, or pets, it'll be annoying not to affect them. NPC's are hard enough to protect with their poor AI, let alone with skills being changed to no longer aid them.

Monk is pretty stable. I don't think there's much to change about them. Their healing is efficient, their smiting line is one of the most effective damaging spell-based lines in the game, and thier protection skills are great as well. It'd be nice if all classes were this versatile, with a primary attribute that compliments most of their skills.
A few more tweaks on some skills and they should be perfect

===
Necromancer:

* Putrid Explosion: Increased recharge time to 5 seconds
: Prevents massive chain reactions. I suppose that was for the best. Its still pretty useful, and with it around, I doubt many other corpse exploitation skills will see much use.

* Consume Corpse: Decreased casting time to 1 second; increased Energy gained to 5..20
:Fast enough to rival a Putrid, health, and additional energy gain as well. Not sure if it'll see use, but it's actually decent enough to consider now. I'd probably still rather explode a corpse with Putrid, given the option, though.

* Blood Renewal: Increased Health regeneration to 3..6
:It's no healing breeze, and I still doubt anyone's going to use it casually, but that probably made Dark Aura builds cheer. More regeneration is always nice for Aura of the Lich builds.

* Plague Signet: Decreased recharge time to 10 seconds
Not fast enough recharge to rival condition placement, and considering how common place Mend Ailment is, I don't think you want to dump mass conditions on a single person.

* Deathly Chill: Increased secondary damage to 5..50
Actually used it, and it's still not good. The bulk of the damage is conditional, it's expensive, and it takes 5 seconds to recharge. Are you supposed to focus fire on a person until they're below half health and switch targets, or what?
I'd rather be an Air ele and weild Lightning Strike.

* Dark Bond: Now affects all damage types, not just physical
This might see a lot more use, depending... If I recall correctly, Taste of Death can eat minions created by any of your party members. That being the case, this might be a good skill to grab for a non-minion master, to make good use of the minions around.

* Barbed Signet: Reduced recharge time to 20 seconds
It barely steals more than it heals under normal circumstances, so this was a good change. It's still not very good, except to help maintain energy in a Dark Aura build, and even then, it's too slow.

* Well of Suffering: Increased duration to 10..30 seconds; increased Health degeneration to 1..6
Ok, this spell is still garbage. If this lasted for 20...60 with health degeneration 2...12, it'd still be bad. Step out of the well, and, tada.
Why not spike 100+ damage in one Putrid, without relying on people standing in the well for the duration?
On the bright side, at least the damage is more reasonable. Previously, you might get a little more damage than Putrid if the target stood in the well the whole time, and that's it. Now, you can get up to ~380 if they're willing to stand in it the whole time with max death.

* Grenth's Balance: Reduced recharge time to 15 seconds
:Useable more often with the nerf, reasonable. I usually grab Offering of Blood as a necromancer, so I don't have much experience with this skill, except as a boss killer, pre-nerf.

* Spinal Shivers: Increased duration to 10..40 seconds
:The duration was never the problem. You'll run out of energy before the shorter duration runs out. The energy will drop down to 4 per interrupt at 17 curses, so either maintaining your pool or managing to prevent the hex from being removed is much more important to you then recasting in 30 seconds. Change 30 to 40 and you have the skill as it is now.

The necromancer class doesn't amaze me, but I'm in a hurry, and arguments about self-healing being a useful aspect to skills is going to have to wait. I still think there's a lot of room for improvement, but we'll just have to wait.
---
Ranger-

* Pets: Increased pets' run speed by 20%; increased pets' armor to 80 at level 20
:Good, pets need some loving, and hopefully some more in the future in terms of AI.

* Crippling Shot: Decreased recharge time to 1 second; decreased duration of Cripple to 8 seconds
:Never used this, so no comment.

* Distracting Shot: Decreased attack time from .75 to .5 seconds
:Good, it's an interrupt, and as such, it requires faster attack time.

* Punishing Shot: Decreased attack time from .75 to .5 seconds; increased recharge time to 8 seconds
:See above on the attack time, never really used it so no judgement on whether it needed nerfing or not.

* Concussion Shot: Decreased attack time from .75 to .5 seconds
:Same about the attack time. This skill is still disproportionately expensive for the actual chance of inflicting dazed, and managing to keep it on, since it'll most likely be removed.

* All Spirits: The effects of Spirits no longer work on other Spirits (example: Fertile Season no longer adds Health and armor to other Spirits); also, when a Spirit is cast, it kills all other allied Spirits of the same type within its range
: Haven't played with the spirits yet, I'll get there.

I love the ranger class as it is. Disruption, damage, and unique skills to control the battle field. Even with the damage nerf prior to release, and the next change to Nature Rituals, they're still a great class.
The only thing I really have an issue with about them is that I don't see them meshing well with many secondary professions. Many rangers I know use almost entirely all ranger skills, especially because of the Expertise discount.
---
Warrior

* Dwarven Battle Stance: Increased duration to 5..11 seconds
:2 (or is it just 1 more at 16 compared to the old 16?) more seconds... Isn't that the equivalent of one hammer hit? Seeing as it's a stance, and you can't use attack speed increases with it, and it costs 10, you'd think it might be a little better.

* "I Will Survive!": Decreased recharge time to 30 seconds
* "I Will Avenge You!": Increased AOE to anywhere within your radar
:If you're going to use either shout, I'd go with I Will Avenge You. Longer duration with more dead allies, and an attack speed buff without a stance (which I might add, is unique). In either case, if you're being hit, as a warrior, your team has probably already lost, or is losing, and neither one is going to make an amazing comeback for your team, though.
In other words, unless people make a strategy of stacking a Run Buff with dead pets to trigger 40-50 second long "I Will Avenge You", if that even works, I don't think either will see more usage.

The warrior profession is capable of some amazing damage, and has great armor. They're more easily shut down, but the buffs they can be enhanced with have no equivalent for casters, so it plays out pretty equally.
The warrior is another great profession, in my opinion, in need of little change. Just some major skill tweaking, because there're still some skills that will never see the light of day.

[edit: And I apologize for the rush job. Despite popular reasoning, you can be in a hurry, as I have somewhere to go, coupled with internet connectivity problems, part of the reason I'm not playing in the PvP Extreme at this moment. I'll fix typos and redundant phrases later, along with my opinion on necromancers.
I just wanted to get what I had up ASAP, and it's mostly complete.
Expect a lot of changes in word choice to make the reading flow more smoothly in the future.]

Grigori Sokolov · Aug 26, 2005, 08:43 PM // 20:43

hmm, let me point out 2 spots I have problems with:

Distract rangers: more distracting
Heal monks: less healing

wow. thanks, anet. I really want more distract rangers.